Just Make Art
A conversation about making art and the artist's journey with Ty Nathan Clark and Nathan Terborg, two artists trying to navigate the art world, just like you.
In each episode, the duo chooses a quote from a known artist and uses it as a springboard for discussion.
Through their conversations, Ty and Nathan explore the deeper meaning of the quote and how it can be applied to the artists studio practice. They share their own personal stories and struggles as artists, and offer practical advice and tips for overcoming obstacles and achieving artistic success.
Whether you're a seasoned artist or just starting out, "Just Make Art" provides valuable insights and inspiration to help you navigate the creative process and bring your artistic vision to life. With their engaging and conversational style, Ty and Nathan create a welcoming space for listeners to explore their own artistic passions and learn from two artists working hard to navigate the art world.
Just Make Art
The Emerging Artist Life: Visionary Projects Blayne Planit talks with Ty Nathan Clark
Could social media be the key to unlocking an artist's full potential? Join us for a special episode of Just Make Art as VIsionary Projects co-founder Blayne Planit sits down with our Ty Nathan Clark, to uncover the transformative power of digital platforms in the art world. Ty takes us through his journey, enriched by family influences and global experiences, demonstrating how modern tools like Instagram have become critical in building connections and expanding an artist's reach. With tales of unexpected opportunities and strategic self-promotion, Ty's insights reveal the intricate dance between digital presence and artistic success.
Through Ty's story, we navigate the delicate balance between studio work and networking, offering emerging artists a blueprint for transitioning from group exhibitions to the coveted solo show. Ty shares invaluable strategies for engaging with galleries, emphasizing the necessity of quality content and thoughtful interactions on social media. The conversation explores how persistence and a proactive approach can lead to significant breakthroughs, illustrating Instagram's role as an indispensable ally in an artist’s career path.
As we close this enriching episode, Ty leaves us with a powerful message about the enduring impact of mentorship and collaboration. He discusses his commitment to nurturing emerging talents through his mentorship program, underscoring the importance of fostering a supportive community. By sharing personal anecdotes of growth and the triumphs achieved through partnership, Ty inspires artists to embrace each opportunity as a chance to learn and evolve, ultimately crafting a dynamic and accessible art world for all.
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@justmakeartpodcast @tynathanclark @nathanterborg
so we are super excited to um introduce ty um all. For those of you who um might not know who ty is, he has been a tableau member for almost over I think a bit over a year now, um, and he's also an incredibly talented um multidisciplinary artist, um, and he's also the incredibly talented um multidisciplinary artist, um, and he's also the co-host of a podcast called just make art podcast. He also does many other, has many other endeavors, uh, which he will share himself Um. But yeah, thank you so much, ty, for being here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm, I'm so excited, so excited to be here.
Speaker 1:Amazing. So we're going to have a chat and we're going to learn a bit more about the business of being an artist, so thanks so much for being with us here tonight. I was thinking I could read your very long bio to everyone, but I thought it would just be great to pass it to you, for you to kick off by just like introducing yourself a bit more and sharing a bit more in depth, like a bit more of an overview of who you are, what you do, which will help give more context as I ask you, as I ask you questions throughout the evening.
Speaker 2:Absolutely yeah. So I'm a multidisciplinary artist in Waco, texas, a small town in between Dallas and Austin. I will be back in Austin, coming up pretty soon here, as soon as we find a place to move back to Austin. That's where we were before and so I have been making art since I can remember. I grew up in a family that was really surrounded by art, because my uncle was a world-renowned Raku artist and sculptor and a professor at UCSB in Santa Barbara in ceramics, and so I've always just been around it and have this passion for it ceramics and so I've always just been around it and have this passion for it. And through my lifetime I've traveled all over the world and lived in multiple countries. I've been on five continents living and learning and studying and playing and doing all kinds of stuff, and just that ability to be in other cultures and learn from other cultures and eat different foods and smell different smells just has absolutely inspired so much within my work, and I have also worked in film. I've also written a novel and I write as well.
Speaker 2:I grew up learning that from my grandfather, as well as art, and, like Blaine said, I have a podcast that is for you all, for beginning and emerging artists with one of my former mentees from an artist mentorship program that I have, where I have worked with 62 artists now from 21 countries around the world in my program and my co-host is now one of my best friends and was a former student in my program, so definitely check it out. I think you'll get a lot of meat from it. I really do. We do it for what we're talking about today just that struggle of being an artist and trying to get your work somewhere and trying to grow in your work and stuff. So I've studied under some great mentors, including one of my professors in college, american sculptor William Catling, and the Japanese American artist, makoto Fujimura, who's out of New Jersey and New York, and honestly, I just love being involved in culture and community and any type of issues that surround the arts.
Speaker 2:So I always try to place myself in arenas to be in the mix. That's why I'm in Visionary and Tableau all the way from Waco, texas, so I can be in the mix with artists from all over the world, and so I currently work here in Waco. My wife is here with me. I have my little puppy we don't have kids Just had my 50th birthday two weeks ago and I can't believe that I'm halfway through life and I have work all over the US. So I've got dealers and galleries that I've worked with and interior designers and things over the years and I'm excited to kind of share that journey and how I got to those moments too today. So that's a little bit about me.
Speaker 1:Amazing, I feel like you like tie that up so nicely because you do so much. Um, I knew it would sound better coming from you and happy belated birthday.
Speaker 2:Thank you.
Speaker 1:I'm also a Libra, so we're, we're, we're in it together. Um, cool, so um, I would love to know did you always have a vision for who you wanted to be and like where you wanted to be, or has it been more organic, the way that it's all unfolded for you after over the past many years?
Speaker 2:That's such a great question. That's something that I encourage everybody that's on here to journal about later tonight. Such a good question, Just thinking back on those things and how you got to today. I always had a goal and a focus, and I think that was because of my uncle. Art was always around in Santa Barbara at my grandparents' house and at my uncle's house there, and so I was surrounded by it and my grandfather would always teach me about the legends of art history and the legends of poetry and literature, and he would read to me and he would discuss these things with me and he would tell me about the great art friendships like Van Gogh and Gauguin, and he'd teach me about the beehive and the impressionists, and all I wanted to do was be that the books that he would have on my lap that I have today, all the big coffee table books from the Met and Smithsonian and MoMA all these they're all on my bookshelf today, and so I always had that dream of that's what I wanted to do, and so my parents always had stuff clay and watercolors and paints and things for my brothers and I and we always just played with art, and then in high school I had I can probably feel like I had the best art teachers known to me Toby, Mario and Kim, who are still dear friends today, all the way back in Northern California. I keep in touch with them. I saw them a few years back at my 30th reunion and we spent an entire day together and they just inspired and pushed me in a way that gave me so much confidence that I can do this.
Speaker 2:So then I got a basketball scholarship to college and studied art there at the art school, and that was my goal let's get through school and let's do art. And then, after school is out, I went. What the fuck do I do? I think anybody that's been to art school or not. Art school that's the first thing that happens. The door's shut, you walk out and you go.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, thanks for teaching me nothing. Thanks for not telling me how to do this. Thanks for teaching me nothing. Thanks for not telling me how to do this. And so I did everything on God's green earth you could imagine from working in retail, managing retail, started a fashion brand and outdoor brand, did all these different things, worked in marketing and PR and all these things to finally get to the point when, 10 years ago I could go full-time as an artist. So that's kind of like my goal has been laser focused. I wrote a list when I was 10 years old of all the goals I have to accomplish and it had be in art galleries, have a museum show, have a coffee table book like the ones at grandpa's, like it. Had that list and so I've slowly been checking that list off over the last 50 years. Had that list and so I've slowly been checking that list off over the last 50 years.
Speaker 1:So that's incredible and that's so inspiring. I don't think, like I feel like most 10 year olds, like even if they did write that, like write down what they saw for themselves, it might not be, it might it would change a lot over the course of years. So I think it's really incredible when people find their purpose so young. Um, it's really inspiring. Um, that's so special. Um. I'm curious like how well, first of all, those are like incredible accomplishments. Um, so congrats. Um. I'm curious, like how did you uh get started selling your artwork? Um, and like how old were you when you made your first sale? And like when did you realize that you could sell the artwork that you're making? Like how did it? When did it like materialize in a real way for you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so once I left art school in 99, I was, you know, working retail and scrapping and doing the things and artists would do, and I was painting on a back porch that if I left stuff out in the rain it got wet and got ruined in a little teeny apartment, you know. And I ended up randomly, when I left California to move to Texas, I had a couple employees in the retail world that were at University of North Texas drawing and painting program and so we would get together and hang out and paint and they were in. If you don't know, university of North Texas is one of the top drawing and painting programs in the country. Usually at times we'll go flip-flop with with Yale that's how impressive the program is. They're in Denton, texas, and so they obviously had very big professors who were major in the art world. And so I feel like that dream of I'm just trying to do stuff. Well, all of a sudden I was kind of back in that art school mindset again. If I'm going for this, I'm doing this. So we started doing our own shows. We literally would go, we'd find a barn in the middle of Denton Texas and ask the owner if we could clean it out and do a show and we would set up all of our work and invite our friends and the art program and art professors and we just started doing our own shows. We didn't sell anything, but it was like this momentum started to build and the dream started to get really real and then we did a pop-up exhibition in 2009.
Speaker 2:So this is fast forwarding at a large lofts in Dallas, texas, that was a fundraiser for a nonprofit and we gathered, I think, 60 artists and photographers that we knew and cleaned out probably an 8,000 square foot basement of these lofts and did a big show and I sold my first major piece in that show and I remember my wife was so mad at me because I negotiated with the guy and he negotiated me down so low, but I was so excited to get money there because he lived there that I sold the piece for not a lot of money, but to me it felt like such an incredible transaction, not just for art but for my art career. It was like a transaction of like. I just took a step here. I negotiated a sale in a space that we set up and the guy lived upstairs, so I got to go up there afterwards and put it on his wall.
Speaker 2:I mean, it was magic and it's just as those. You know, we all have those moments kind of in our story that are just these like boom, boom, boom and we can just cross those lines and those dots to things that give us that next big jump. And so it was 2009 at the love event in Dallas. Wow, that's after I saw your questions, I had to go back on Facebook and go back to little shows and stuff to figure out the date. So that was fun.
Speaker 1:Had you ever sold anything on like a way smaller scale prior? I was just curious for, like, even during art school, like, did you have any transactions, or was it? Or did you do any like art swaps or was it just more focused on like creating until?
Speaker 2:swaps. You know what I mean. I feel like I did a lot of swaps or like gave people pieces or things. I don't even think I had the first clue, honestly, to what it meant to sell a piece of art or even price my work at that point in time.
Speaker 1:Right Interesting Um, and so I know that you were really inspired I think you also mentioned this by your uncle, um Conway, Jiggs Pearson. Um, so in what ways do you think that, like he shaped the way you view art and business? Um, and the way that you know, make that that you've approached like making a name for yourself and building your career in this industry, and I'm curious if he, yeah, like what guidance he gave you in general?
Speaker 2:So he passed when I was 10 years old Wow, he was 28 years older than my mom. Okay, so he passed, and so all I have are these random memories of him that aren't really very deep relationally but they were very deep on like a hero level, like impact, impact. He, okay, he was your quintessential ceramicist, right, dirty jeans that had clay in them all the time, clay under his fingernails, big white beard overalls, that kind of unbuttoned long sleeve shirt, you know that would be kind of rolled up so he fit this mold right. If, like, if, I see a picture of Monet in his garden, it's like that's my uncle Jiggs, you know, had that kind of feel and so. But his work was everywhere and I mean I have a show poster here in my office sitting on the wall that is kind of just an encouragement for me, but it's just a show poster from a show of his in Osaka, japan.
Speaker 1:That's beautiful.
Speaker 2:And so that's just those things were present at my grandparents' house, at my aunt's house, and he had a kiln in the backyard when he won an award from the National Endowments of the Arts Artist of the Year, I think, in 69. They bought him a kiln the NEA did and so it was in his backyard. So there's all this things going on that I was, so I knew it was possible, that's what it gave me. I didn't get to learn the business side, I got to learn that's something that is reachable and attainable and possible and that's what it really taught me I can do this. And I think that really hit me when I was older. Right, Really needed that fire or that. Something to help in those moments of resistance and frustration and confusion was like I know it's possible.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's beautiful. Um, could you share some insights on how you land opportunities for yourself as an artist? Yes, I mean, it sounds like you're very self-motivated and created your own opportunities from the start. Um, so I'd be curious on, like, how you built from there.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I just did a collector's talk last night at a small museum.
Speaker 1:I saw that I was talking about this last night.
Speaker 2:Instagram Instagram Instagram. Instagram Instagram. This is beautiful. This is a beautiful thing that you know. I had a pretty big network on MySpace. For those of you who are old enough to remember MySpace, that was made up of artists.
Speaker 1:I loved MySpace, I know.
Speaker 2:That was artists and musicians that I built there. I mean, random people is the greatest thing in the world. I can talk to an artist in Spain, what? And then, when MySpace died, that all kind of transferred to Facebook, that network. We all kind of got together on Facebook and then that all migrated to Instagram.
Speaker 2:And then, literally in 2010, when Instagram started, I started following Heather Day. She is the experiment on how to be successful in social media. She's the first artist to explode, career wise because of social media and at that time, my Instagram was that normal Instagram page pictures of wine at dinner, trips, sunsets, my feet at the pool, right, like all that stuff back then. But I was following her and I was going. She's exploding. I was following her on Instagram, but then everywhere else where her shows were, where she was popping up and I was going. So in 2011, I changed everything. I deleted my whole feed and I just started doing everything that Heather was doing process photos, talking about the work, videos of me in the studio and, honestly, that just brought a flood. I just happened to be really fortunate at the time when Instagram still grew organically, right, and I followed somebody that nailed exactly what artists need to do and, like I tell artists all the time, don't care about growing your numbers, care about the quality of what you're putting in your feed, your work, your process, be vulnerable, talk about stuff.
Speaker 2:Somebody is probably watching you and the art world watches but and they don't follow. They don't click follow, they watch, they don't click follow, they don't click like they watch and they watch and they watch and they watch. And then they send an email and it's usually pretty short. If you've read Get the Picture by Bianca Bosker you get some moments from Bianca where she says, yeah, the art world sends really short emails so they can sound like they're really, really busy. So if you ever get a really long email from somebody, it's probably a vanity gallery. Just so you know, the art world's really short and sometimes they only do they don't even do a body email, they just do a subject line. So it's pretty funny. That is funny. That's really how everything came for me was through Instagram.
Speaker 1:And could you elaborate a little more Like, if you remember maybe the first opportunity that came through Instagram and maybe most, maybe the oldest memory you have for and maybe the most recent, and were these? Can you expand on what type of opportunities they were as well?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I'll do three. I'll talk about one that was great, one that didn't pan out, another one that's really great. So I got a. Got an email one day this is, I forget what year it was, and it was a gallery in North Carolina. Hey, been following your Instagram for a while. Love to talk to you about doing a solo show. Had not had a solo show, only group shows and juried shows and things like that Nothing major at all. And I mean, this is probably eight years ago and I was like what? So got on the phone, hopped on, had a great conversation, set up a solo show for the following year in Charlotte, north Carolina, and it was literally she'd been following me for, I think, six or eight months or something, maybe a year, and then finally just sent an email. Was not following me, following me Okay, we're talking just watching, having your name on a list and having the interns or the gallery assistant keep track of things and then eventually, if they feel like you're a great fit, sending that email. So that happened from Instagram.
Speaker 2:And then one day I got a random email when I was at a friend's house. It was literally a subject line and it said send me a catalog, no body text or anything. And then the name said Stefan Simkowitz and I went I don't even know who this is. And so I looked it up. Do your research. Anytime you get a random email from somebody, search their email address, search their name. Do a deep dive before you reply, as we get a lot of spam, us artists a lot, um and all the first thing that came up was the cover of art forum, uh, and a bunch of other magazines with him on the cover as the anti art world gallerist. And so I went okay, this is legit. I sent a catalog, didn't hear back. Right, that's the oh man. Oh, did he get it? Did it go through? That's a that even. Oh, my gosh. So then, finally, a week later, I said hey, did you get my catalog? Just want to make sure I can resend if I need to. And it responded back. I did Thanks, just want to make sure I can resend if I need to. And he responded back I did Thanks, not for me right now, that was it, but that taught me something. I'm doing something right. If he found me Right, I'm doing something right If somehow he discovered me on Instagram and sent me a message, whether he wanted it or not. The art world said I want to send this guy an email.
Speaker 2:The third one that happened just like Simkowitz. I got a random email one day and it said hey, ty, I'd love to see your work. Johnny Wolf I have no idea who this is, so I went to his website, look him up. He's an art dealer and a curator in LA. He's been on the board at LACMA. He also deals in secondary art Basquiat, rothko, lots of big art and I thought, oh, it's going to be just like Simkowitz. So I sent him a catalog. I don't hear back for a month and then finally, a month later, I hear back hey, ty, I want to commission your entire catalog. I went that's like 80 works that I sent him. That's insane.
Speaker 2:It was for six months and at first I was like oh, what then? What do I do? And I went oh, this is good, that means I have to make a lot more new months. Didn't hear a thing for a year, didn't respond to emails, contract was up Every few months. I would say hey, do you want to renew the contract? What do you want to do? Nothing for a year.
Speaker 2:Almost a year later, I get an email that says hey, ty, I need these five pieces.
Speaker 2:I just sold them to a client in New Zealand and it was newer work that was not in the catalog, because what I would do is still in his Dropbox folder, update the catalog that was in there.
Speaker 2:Even though he wasn't responding, I continued to update my catalog with new work and drop a new catalog in the Dropbox that he had for the old one. And he sold five works to a client in New Zealand major sale and they were between six feet and five and five foot pieces, so larger works as well. And that has been probably my second best relationship I've ever had in the art world. Same with my dealer in Houston same thing, but this one. I took initiative. She I saw that it was a new dealer in Houston that was representing a few friends. So I sent a direct message and said hey, I've got some friends that look like are working with you. If you're looking to add anybody new to your roster, I'd love to have a conversation. She responded back Can we talk today? She sold more work for me in the last five years than anybody that ever has, so those are all through Instagram.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's amazing. So the galleries that currently represent you did you make those connections through Instagram as well?
Speaker 2:All Instagram.
Speaker 1:Wow, and so there's a mix, like a lot of them you had reached out to.
Speaker 2:I have reached out to some. I court them very intelligently. So if there's a gal, I have a list of galleries on a spreadsheet and they're all segmented from galleries I fit in galleries who have people I've shown with some of the galleries I fit in that I have my dream galleries, right the white cubes, this Werner's, the schnob, beto Schnabel's, all those dream ones, right, the McNerney's. But I court the ones on. The ones I fit in that aren't big. I may feel like I fit in Zwirner at times, but I know I don't, but you know what I mean. But those ones that I know I fit in, I will court them on Instagram. I will like every single post they have. I will comment on the new exhibitions. I will comment on work I really love, but not emojis.
Speaker 2:I really give a critics type of response to the work and how powerful it is and how I like it. And then I wait. If they engage me, I feel like they just extended the hand for a relationship to begin and then I'll take it to a DM after that and engage Usually with. If I'm in New York, I'd love to come by and bring your staff coffees and just say hello, things like that I'm going to be in LA next week. I'd love to stop in and I'm letting them know I'm coming, so that when I'm there they go oh Ty, wow, it's great to see you here. Or, if they don't remember, oh yeah, I was chatting with the so-and-so on Instagram last week, those types of things, but, um, but I'm very, very smart and intelligent about it and I am very patient with it too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, amazing. What advice would you give to artists that are just starting out, or artists who have experience being exhibited in group exhibitions but are wanting to have solo shows and representation? Like what would be some of your, your best advice there?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So, man, make that list. I'm telling you right now, if you don't make a spreadsheet or a list, you're going to forget the ones that are a little more off the grid than you would normally remember. We come across galleries on Instagram and things all the time. I use artsy for my research. So I'll go on artsy in the gallery section and I'll type in Dallas, texas, in the gallery section and I'll go look at all the galleries in Dallas and then I'll go through all the galleries and I'll look to see if there's any artists I've shown with before. But I also look at the work. If they have prices up on ARCSEA, I look at their price points too, because that'll also give you a really good working knowledge of if you fit or not. If your work is averaging around $5,000 and most of the work in this galleries at 15, you got a few years to get there. Even if your work is a strong right now, you might have a little more time to get there.
Speaker 2:Um, so I make that list and then I go. I don't get to go to as much, but if you're in an area where you can go, go to every single opening you can go to make yourself seen, make yourself known, even if you're a fly on the wall, even if you're so introverted that this is the most awkward and hard thing in the world to do. Just go grab a drink and stand in the corner. Somebody will remember you and somebody will say hello at some point. Because if you want to be interesting, you have to be interested. Because if you want to be interesting, you have to be interested. Everything in the art world is for selfish reasons, but if you're really interested and you want to build that relationship and be in that place, go to everything and be seen and be known, give interest in what they're doing, people will respond back. And then, honestly, instagram oh, I can't tell you be really intelligent with your feed. Your descriptions now are just as important as hashtags and the image that you share. The Instagram algorithm crawls your description as much as it does everything else. Now I had a call with Instagram a few months ago discussing all the new algorithm things and stuff coming out and they were saying man, multiple images and videos in one feed and being able to have a really well written description for what you're posting. Words right. Abstract art, figurative art, art galleries Put those things in your post, right, it'll be crawled. Who knows who's watching now? Abstract art, figurative art, art galleries Put those things in your post, right, it'll be crawled. Who knows who's watching? Now people go to hashtags and look for things. Gallerists crawl through abstract art hashtag and just do a crawl and if something piques their interest they look. So put up. Talk about stuff.
Speaker 2:You don't have to post every day. You can do three days a week's, fine. You don't have to post every day. You can do three days a week's, fine. You don't have to do seven days a week, like you used to. But make sure your work looks good in your photos. Don't put up really dark, crappy photos. That's a turnoff. Make sure your work is really highlighted beautifully.
Speaker 2:As an example, one of my former mentees is the co-host on my podcast got an email a few months ago from a gallerist in Munich. Nathan, I've been following you for a year. I follow your journey almost weekly. It's been so impressive watching you grow Note that, watching you grow over time and we want to take a chance on you before the art world finds you. Want to take a chance on you before the art world finds you. This is a massive mid-career gallery in Munich. He's had two tiny little solo shows. In Denver with a new opening startup gallery. He has a two-person show with Kit King, who is one of the largest female international artists in the world. She is insane. It's the Benjamin at gallery. He has a two person show for his first major exhibition in Munich, all because somebody was following his Instagram feed. That's insane. And then I have another artist in Spain, moxonanda, who was just featured. He hadn't had a show yet.
Speaker 2:Before my mentorship program we really worked on confidence, building confidence. He worked on his work for a year and then just started going into galleries and asking if he could have an exhibition boldly. That's a little more acceptable in Spain than it is in the US, so I do not advise that in the States, but in Spain that is something that is more acceptable to go in and pitch yourself to a gallerist. And he's had multiple shows and was just featured on arts artsies new global curation list of 200 artists. Today that's within two years. I'll talk about how to get there in a little bit when you do something else, but that was really just building out Instagram, working hard on his work and then being bold enough to go out and pitch his work because he was confident in it. Now, that's the other key If you're not confident in your work, don't go push it out there, yet Somebody will spell non-confidence on you pretty easily, pretty quickly pretty quickly.
Speaker 1:That's all such incredible information, thank you. What do you think the most important things are that an artist needs to do in order to create a strong foundation for a long-term career as a selling artist?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love this question because one of my favorite quotes from Hippocrates in 430 BC that was kind of translated a little different is art is long, life is short, experience is treacherous. Right, I mean, that's the life of an artist, right, time, patience, the work is number one. The work is by far and away number one. You have to be putting the time in that you have. Most of us all work, have side jobs, have patron type things, like my mentorship program. Some of us have two or three jobs. The time you have to make work, you're going to have to make sacrifices in life to make work, and a lot of it. Right, you've got to spend that time. Next to work. The network is number two. You've got to build a network. You've got to go to shows and if you're in a place that is so far away from the art world, use Instagram to build that network.
Speaker 2:Reach out to artists that you have things in common with. Why are we all here? Right, with Tableau and Visionary Projects? Right, we're all hoping for that network. Connect to the artists within the network. Do things together, talk together, look and listen at lots of work.
Speaker 2:Read books, listen to podcasts, study art history, go to freaking museums and galleries. Why? Because that is going to teach you more about your work than you being in the studio every day. All the things you're going to learn from going to museums and galleries and looking at work you love and looking at work you hate. When you come back to the studio, your brain is going to go from here to here. Now, all of the ghosts of those artists are going to be whispering in your ear about depth and composition and texture and color and all those things, things you can't learn on your own, things you need people whispering to you about.
Speaker 2:And why do I say read and study? Because every artist in history has been exactly where you are at some point in their life. There are no superheroes in the art world. They're all regular human beings, just like us, who worked their butts off, sacrificed, like us who worked their butts off, sacrificed and had a lot of luck as well.
Speaker 2:So study, study, study. Because in the moments when you're like ready to throw the towel, in which I have been many times, you hear Joan Mitchell in your ear, or you hear Joan Miro in your ear, or you hear Burt Morissette in your ear saying I was there when I was 30. I was there when I was 40. I almost quit but I kept going and I know it because I read it and I heard him say it, and so then you have that confidence. I'm reading de Kooning's biography right now. De Kooning didn't have his first major show until 46 years old. Then he didn't sell his first major works until 51. Willem de Kooning, like, think about that, somebody you see in a museum wall that you just assume had that Midas touch and was probably everywhere in their 20s. You know, no, it took him that long to get there. Art takes time. I don't even know if I answered the question.
Speaker 1:Crossed it, the work, the network, study look and listen and those are the most important things that an artist needs to do in order to create a strong foundation for a long-term career? Absolutely yes. I'm curious about some challenges that you faced as an artist over the years and, like in what ways you've grown from those challenges. I mean I think overall it sounds like I mean we all know there's many challenges, but if there's anything to pinpoint specifically that maybe had like a bigger learning, curve.
Speaker 2:I'm an art. I'm a purist. I'm an art to make the strongest work I can make in my lifetime. If I sell work in that process I'm really freaking excited and my wife is really excited too. But I'm not in it to sell work. I I I'm in it for the things that I learned from my grandfather when I was young.
Speaker 2:If I can make work my whole life and put a lot of time into it, if I can make work my whole life and put a lot of time into it, if I can take risks and trust the process, I am 100% confident that by the end of my lifetime I might have work that lasts in a museum. That's why I'm in it. So that means I have to evolve constantly, I have to take risks, I have to change. I have to be constantly trying new things. That doesn't mean every day. That means I do a body of work for four months or six months or eight months and then I've learned that that body of work is teaching me about what is next. I'm leaving these unraveled threads in my work that is leading me to something down the road that may be so risk taking that I have a show in Houston. This is a real story. Such a big risk to try something new. And then I have a solo show in Houston with all that work and I don't sell one piece in that show, right. And then I come back to the studio and I go.
Speaker 2:I just wasted five months of my life. Why am I doing so? I let myself have a day before I move on and I bitch and I moan and I complain and I look at everything. And why are you doing this? Oh my gosh, you spent so much money. You rented the truck to get the work down there, but that entire body of work two bodies of work later helped me create some of my strongest work. If I hadn't have taken that time and that energy to just follow these threads somewhere, it wouldn't have taught me where that next conceptual leap came from. So my biggest challenge is always lying taking those moments of risk. That might set me back a while, but knowing the rewards are going to be far greater if I'm patient and keep pushing through and working. Does that make sense?
Speaker 1:Absolutely, Definitely. And on the flip side, what is a proud moment that you've had in your career and how did you make it possible for yourself? Yeah, probably through Instagram, but um, actually is not, so this one.
Speaker 2:I had a museum exhibition last year with my best friend, uh Vietnamese American female artist in Austin, Texas, Vino, who is also a chief of medicine at a hospital. She's a complete badass. So every time I think like I haven't been making enough work. I'm like, well, V doesn't have as much time as me, so I need to. You know what I mean. I need to pick it up If she can make work doing that also, being a single mom with two kids, I can do everything I can to make a shit ton of work regularly. Sounds like a superhero. I can do everything I can to make a shit ton of work regularly. Sounds like a superhero. He is an absolute superhero.
Speaker 2:We had a two-person exhibition last year. That was a dream. To be able to have an exhibition with one of your best friends in the world that you know the work will speak together was such a beautiful moment. This is at our small museum in Waco that has a new, incredible building with three separate galleries within the space and a really large installation area in the back. So we filled the whole thing. I think we had 23 works each. I had sculptures and paintings and then we each had a very large installation in the back as well and I've gotten to know some of the board when we first moved to Waco nine years ago but they had a little space at the community college back then but they since did a major fundraise and built the actual museum property.
Speaker 2:That is beautiful and I helped get a few female friends on the board, because it was a pretty heavily seated male board and nobody really knew art on the board Small town, they're businessmen. They had no direction. It was a mess. And I got a young sculptor, Morgan Earing, who's a dear friend, on the board and I got my best friend here. Dr Jane Dameron, who curates a lot of my shows, is now the board chair. Dr Jane Dameron, who curates a lot of my shows, is now the board chair, and so they were key in helping make sure they had me on the calendar for a show in an upcoming year, and so I also had them co-curate the show so that they could also have that on their resume as curators of a museum exhibition. So that's probably for me, that is an absolute career highlight for me. Yeah, it sounds incredible. There were plenty of tears, I'll put it that way.
Speaker 1:So that's probably for me that is an absolute career highlight for me. Yeah, it sounds incredible, plenty of tears, I'll.
Speaker 2:I'll put it that way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that sounds really special. Um, so we yeah, we still have some time. Um, a lot of artists, as you know, are really intimidated by the idea of marketing themselves, and you also touched on confidence super briefly and I thought it was really interesting what you said. Maybe we could chat about that for a bit, because I'd love to hear any advice you might have, because, even through this conversation and pretty much every single person I've been doing this for over a year that we have on as our guests, like even when Haley and I are doing panels, like whatever we're doing, anytime we're speaking to anyone in the art world, no matter where they sit, instagram comes up. So and yeah, it's a big focus also for us and when we have our incubator, et cetera. So, yeah, we'd just love to hear specifically your thoughts and maybe words of wisdom for how to get started, or maybe some advice.
Speaker 2:I mean, listen, you are all doing this because you love it so much and it is a part of you. You cannot escape it. You are doing this because you cannot escape it. It's a part of your soul. You are doing this because you cannot escape it. It's a part of your soul. It's a part of your creative being, your created being. This is in you, this is part of you.
Speaker 2:I know I'm extroverted, but I'm a forced introvert, right? Because you know why you do it. You know how much you love it. You have an absolute confidence in making your work. That's why you're still making it. That's why you haven't thrown in the towel, you haven't given up. You spend money you could spend on rent and food and bills to buy art supplies and things, because you can't escape this feeling inside. That is confidence. That is a confidence that you can exude in the moments where you're very afraid and you're very scared. Jerry Salt says it best when the demons arise in the middle of the night, sit up, say out loud I'm a fucking genius, I know this.
Speaker 2:Instagram is a great place to practice that confidence. Because you're not in front of people, you're not on the panel in front of a crowd, you're not at the show with somebody asking you questions. There's still a wall there. Practice being vulnerable and talking about your art on instagram. This is a great place to practice so that when you have the opportunity, when you have a show and a group show and the gallerist says, hey, we'd love to do a lecture, does anybody want to be a part of it? You're the first person to raise your hand. What will separate an artist from other artists in a wall? And a gallerist's mind is the one that is always willing to do the extra thing for that gallery. Most artists are introverted and the hands don't go up. I had to teach myself how to really be confident and speak. Even though I'm an extrovert, you're still talking about your work, right? You're still sitting naked in front of the audience with your work on the wall. So if you can practice on Instagram and then take that boldness and confidence to the moments when you do speak because I'm speaking this right into fruition for all of you, I hope that you all have that opportunity to give a little 10 minute talk about your work or do an Instagram live with a friend right now, next week. Great place to practice, even if there's only five people watching you and your friend talking about the work you're making and your process. You don't know who's watching. It's just you and your pal. It's you and your girlfriend, your boyfriend, your partner whoever just talking about work together. Use these things to build confidence for when the opportunity comes and I want to here's a. This is a boost for you. If you don't have the Delphian Gallery book Navigating the Art World, I suggest you buy it.
Speaker 2:94% of people who follow artists on Instagram want to see that artist's exhibition. 79% of people who follow art online see more than in person. Think about that. That has never existed in the art world before. That's like six years, that's like pre-COVID to now new. 57% of the artists that follow artists on Instagram. They feel like they are just as important as the artists they see in person. That means there are artists, that there are people that follow you on Instagram now that think you're just as important as the artists they see in galleries and museums.
Speaker 2:Think about that. What an opportunity for us, right? The blue chip highbrow art world does not control every little trickle down thing that happens in the art world anymore. The world is wide open for us to take advantage of moments and things that we can do to allow an audience to find us. This is the key In art history. The artist had to find the audience. Always, right, van Gogh would have all of his art under his arms and walk to the salon and then have to put all of his work out, and then the gallerist would say yes or no. Well, today we can do things on Instagram that draw an audience to us. Shit, that's magical. I mean, that's incredible. I'll bet if every artist in history knew that, they'd be rolling over in their grave like I wish they had that opportunity. I always say Picasso would have been the selfie king of Instagram, right, if he was alive, he would have done more studio selfies than anybody in history, and he did it before there was even Instagram with his own camera on a tripod, and this is citizens taking pictures.
Speaker 2:So take advantage of what's in front of you, your friends. If you have trouble building confidence yourself, do things with your friends. I have two artists from my mentorship program, jacqueline Borgian and Vered Brett. I think they're both members of Visionary, I'm not sure. Maybe one of them is. They do a talk called Big Baby they just get on. Taken from Jerry Salt's Big Baby. They just get on and talk about their work and what they're doing on Instagram and they just do a live. Do it for like an hour, but it's just building that confidence.
Speaker 2:So, and do shows with your friends. Grab a bunch of friends, of artists, and look for a space. Do it in your apartment. I've done so many shows in my apartments and houses in the past. If you go to my resume, my CV, you'll see house gallery that's my gallery, gallerists, curators, museum. They love artists that take initiative. Oh my gosh, if you don't have lines in your resume, do your own shit. I've, my wife and I have emptied out our entire living room, dining room, kitchen and set up galleries in my house and then I do a lecture and I talk about the work and I invite the community in. So, yes, melissa, amen, love that, kill it. It's going to be awesome. And that goes on your CV. You put it on there. That's a solo show. Seriously, that's huge. When do you get a solo show ever? Do one at your house? Solo show goes on your resume. So, yeah, I get fired up about this stuff. I love you all so much Like I'm in this for not just me, but for all of you. I'm serious.
Speaker 1:I love it. Um, I have one more question and then we have yeah, we're good on time, so we have about like nine 10 minutes. Uh, if anyone wants to ask you additional questions, um, if that's still okay. Um, but I know that you have your own artist mentorship program, so I just want to give you an opportunity to share with everyone the next one you're hosting or any information on that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so right, I'm taking November and December off to just paint. Um, I will have applications on my website. We'll be. It's open right now but I won't really be pushing it out there until probably next month. Um, but January, february, march will be my next session. Um, probably next month, but January, february, march will be my next session. It's juried. So I take I usually have it depends between 10 and 20 artists that apply and I usually accept five to seven for that three month period, just because that I found that's the best number of really building intimacy as a group of artists. So I have a group component, but I also have an individual component.
Speaker 2:And this is not a masterclass. This is not a how to sell art, how to be successful. This is literally foundations for a studio practice and how to grow in your work. It's focused on the work, your work and helping you really grow and take risks. There is goal setting, there is gallery talk, things like that within the program, but it's really me watching, cheerleading, encouraging and helping you maybe see things that you're not able to see with your work and where those opportunities are going to go.
Speaker 2:And I've had 62 artists from mid career to beginning in my program. I've had some artists who make a whole lot more money than I do regularly that are stuck and they're tired of making what they're making. And they're stuck in the gallery world because they have to make what they're making because of their lifestyle and what their galleries want, and they're bored and they hate their work. And so I've had artists that have been in the program and we work on new ideas and new things and how to get bold enough to pitch those to those galleries and things. And so it's three months. There is a cost, it's a patron for me, but with all the artists in my program I am still very connected to them. Some of them have become best friends.
Speaker 2:Just did a residency with seven of them in Newfoundland in May for a month. We all did a month long residency together, a group of artists ranging from 78 years old to 26. It was beautiful, four different countries. So I all the information's on my website. You can look at it if you're interested. Um, so, and it definitely is a commitment. So, um, I tell artists all the time it is a commitment and there is. There is a charge for it, because if you're doing something for free as an artist, you're probably not going to put everything into it honestly, and that's my own experience. If you're paying for something, you're an artist. You're getting everything out of it you can, so yeah.
Speaker 1:Awesome. Well, thank you for everything and for showing up. Um, this was so insightful and inspiring as well. Um, I'm sure other people feel the same, but I would love to. If anyone has any questions, um, I will bring us back to like a group setting. Um, yeah, I'll give everyone an opportunity. Um, you can write a question in the chat. I'm happy to ask it out loud to tie. Or you could raise your hand via zoom or with your own real life hand. Give everyone a second.
Speaker 2:No, you got questions. I've got a question.
Speaker 1:All right, michael, and then Clarissa.
Speaker 4:Um, ty, I really appreciated, uh, your um advice on studying and the benefit of the ghosts of artists whispering in your ear. I love the way that you put that. Um, that's something that I feel like, uh, I experience in my studio while I'm working, and I'm just wondering if you could maybe talk about a couple artists or specific things that have been whispered to you recently in your recent work.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, there's a few ghosts that are with me all the time in the studio and uh they're. Uh, anthony Tappez is with me all the time. Uh, cy Twombly, joe Mitchell, um, joe Miro, uh, helen Frankenthaler you know, just naming some of my favorites who I've studied, studied, studied hard. And now de Kooning, because I'm so entrenched in his biography that the Dutchman in his broken English is constantly whispering things and we actually argue a lot because we have disagreements on some things. You know, and so, but honestly, when I'm working, there are times where literally I may put something down and then I step back and take a moment to listen and I kind of think through, like okay, I'll think through, like okay, well, how would Joan Mitchell have handled this negative space right now? Somebody who is a master at negative space, and I'll, literally it'll take me back to words. I've heard her speak from watching YouTube lectures of hers all the time old school video clips and things but also from reading her biography and reading also biographies of friends talking about her work. And I'll hear her talking through moments and things in her work and how she got there and those things are so helpful.
Speaker 2:Like I said, I'm a forced introvert. I got to force my extroversion in the studio by inviting people in there right To speak to me and talk to me through things. But just being able to have an understanding of how things work from the artists who I emulate and I've stolen from, who are my guides, they're having that knowledge right. What does knowledge become? It becomes wisdom Over the years. Those things just get baked into your subconscious. That's the beautiful thing about neuroscience in the brain. Those things literally get so baked into your subconscious that it becomes secondary to your original thinking and that just flows through you in the studio. So that's why I say study, study, study, find time to fit it in love it awesome. Thank you, yeah, man good question hello, nice to meet you.
Speaker 3:Um, it's been really helpful. So thank you for all your wisdom. Um, I was wondering if you could give me some advice. Um, how do you go about creating under a deadline? I'm experiencing this for the first time. Now. I'm having my first solo show and I have about three days left until I can really send everything off to framing, and I'm starting to look at artworks and not like them anymore, and I feel like it's too late. When to push through, when to really start over, like, how to deal with these? I guess conflicting thoughts in your head.
Speaker 2:Gosh Kalisha, that's such a great question because you don't know till you know right, you have no idea in that spot you're in. And so when I'm working on work, I work in bodies of work all the time, and so I may do 10 to 30 pieces in a body of work with the idea that it will be a solo show. So everything I do is vision cast to if I get a solo show, I'm ready, that's what I do and that's how I operate. But in the beginning, when I had that solo show and four months to create in right, it's like, oh shit, what now? So I just started working and working. I'll tell you that forced deadline is a great thing because it makes you really work, but when you get to the end, it also adds a brand new resistance that you are not aware of, which is am I really happy with the work that I just made? So I always tell artists get that shit out of your head and just realize I'm doing the best I can with what I know right now, and this experience is what's going to guide me to doing even better the next time. So what I say is throw out all the negative thoughts, breathe deep, meditate, do something and go listen. I'm doing the best work that I could do today.
Speaker 2:Once this work is out the door, you're going to go see the exhibition. Don't doubt yourself when you go see the work on the walls. Don't doubt things that you think are weak, that you could do right now. Just know, okay, this is a learning experience. This is my first one. Take it all in, write notes. Oh, maybe I could have done this, maybe I should have done this. But here's the thing it write notes. Oh, maybe I could have done this, maybe I should have done this. But here's the thing. It's a solo show. The art world said yes, somebody said yes to your work and they're putting it in a show. That's rare. I could sit 11 artists, 100 artists in the room right now and say how many of you have had solo shows that are either beginning or lower emerging level? I'd say how many of you have had solo shows that are either beginning or lower emerging level? There's going to be very few people that raise their hands right. So no, okay, this is the first solo show. Is that what you said? Number one congratulations. What a freaking celebration. If I had champagne right now, I'd pop the bottle and celebrate. Only artists know that feeling. Nobody else in our life knows that feeling of selling a piece or getting a show or any of that. So congratulations. So just get in your mind I did the best I could. I'm learning. I'm excited to have this experience.
Speaker 2:After the show is over, sit down and think through everything. Think through how that deadline approach. Journal I'm big on journaling Think through that entire experience. How did I handle things? Did I start too late? Should I have started earlier? Was I only working on one piece at a time? Should I have worked on three or four at one time? How could I have made this experience fit in to a more comfortable zone leading up to the deadline?
Speaker 2:Because we're always going to be butting up against the deadline. We're not going to have our work done a month or two months before the show. We're always going to be going. Can I have a few more days to send the work? I wouldn't advise that. Get it done.
Speaker 2:But that's kind of how we are as artists, because why?
Speaker 2:Everything we're doing is taking us somewhere new. That's art. The work we're doing today is teaching us about our vision. Vision is always ahead of execution. The work in our head is never the work we're making. We're not that good yet right, we're just not. So when you're doing that, you're coming up to the show. You're starting to look at your vision rather than what you can execute on and that's where the resistance really starts to churn and rather than what you can execute on, and that's where the resistance really starts to churn. And then fear comes and then second guessing. So just be confident. You have the opportunity. We're going to knock this out. Get the work there, post show. Look at everything, oh gosh. Look at everything around you and talk to friends. Bring that network in. Hey, what could I have improved on? How could I have done better? Which works did you love? But find the threads in those works that are leading you to the next, to the next work. That's how I view every opportunity I get now.
Speaker 1:I love that.
Speaker 2:Wow, yes, thank you Really send me pictures of the opening. I want to see the work. I want to see the show.
Speaker 3:I will, I will.
Speaker 1:Thank you, Ty. On that note, would you mind do you have access to the chat, I think, if it's okay because we're at time, I think if you want to drop your email for people to reach out and continue the conversation with you, I think that could be a great way to connect. Maybe your at as well, your Instagram handle.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you can also. Yeah, I'm always answering questions on Instagram, too Amazing.
Speaker 1:You're the best. This was just so good. You have such good energy and are so inspiring. So thank you again for your time and thank you everyone for participating.
